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Republican Presidential Hopefuls Debate in Michigan

 DEARBORN, Mich. (AP) - Republican presidential hopefuls Mitt Romney and Rudy Giuliani clashed over tax and spending cuts Tuesday, each saying he was more committed than the other as they vied for conservative support in a debate in the nation's manufacturing heartland.

The government "is spending money of future generations and those yet to be born," added Fred Thompson, making his debate debut after a late entry into the race.

"We are spending money we don't have," he said, although he advocated no specific changes to shift course.

Giuliani and Romney got down to specifics, and sharply, when asked to discuss their differences over economic issues.

"I cut taxes 23 times. I believe in tax cuts," said Giuliani, former mayor of New York.

Romney said they were in agreement about tax cuts, then criticized Giuliani for having filed a court challenge to a law that gave President Clinton the right to veto spending items line by line. "I'm in favor of the line item veto," he said, adding he exercised it 844 times while governor of Massachusetts.

Romney also said that while mayor, Giuliani "fought to keep the commuter tax, which is a very substantial tax ... on consumers coming into New York."

Giuliani responded that spending fell in New York while he was mayor, and rose in Massachusetts while Romney was governor.

"The point is that you've got to control taxes. I did it, he didn't. ... I led, he lagged."

"It's all baloney," retorted Romney. "I did not increase taxes in Massachusetts. I lowered taxes."

The clash was among the most heated of the campaign for the Republican presidential nomination, reflecting a quickening pace as the primaries draw closer.

It also left Thompson and the other contenders as something of bystanders for the several moments that Romney and Giuliani went at one another.

All nine of the men on stage sought to stress their conservative economic credentials throughout the two-hour debate, held in the city that gave birth to the Ford Motor Co. more than a century ago.

Sen. John McCain of Arizona said President Bush was right to veto a children's health expansion bill, and he urged him to reject a multibillion-dollar public works measure as well.

"We've got to get wasteful spending under control," he said.

"We have to get spending under control," agreed Kansas Sen. Sam Brownback. No matter whether Republicans or Democrats are in control of Congress, he said, "the system is built to spend."

Challenged to identify one government account he would cut, Brownback cited a program involving "advanced technology."

"If you want to control federal spending you must look at Social Security and Medicare," said Rep. Tom Tancredo of Colorado. He said he favors private Social Security accounts, or "forget the idea of ending deficit spending."

While maneuvering against one another, the Republicans found a minute or two to jab at Democrats.

Giuliani said he had gone to court to challenge the line-item veto because it was unconstitutional. "So I took President Clinton to court and I beat him. And I don't think it's a bad idea to have a Republican presidential candidate who actually has beat President Clinton at something," he said to laughter.

Romney criticized Michigan Gov. Jennifer Granholm for raising taxes, and drew laughter when he said he was afraid she "was going to put a tax on this debate."

Eight of the candidates support the continuing U.S. military presence in Iraq, but Rep. Ron Paul of Texas drew a loud round of applause when he loudly dissented. Paul posted a surprising $5 million in campaign donations for the three months ending Sept. 30.

By coincidence or design, the first question of the debate went to Thompson, making his first appearance with rivals who have been campaigning for months.

He said the economy is strong, with no threat of a recession in the immediate future.

Romney said it was inexcusable that Michigan was in what he called a nonstop recession, with high unemployment. He said the president must have an open door policy when it comes to the auto industry.

Michigan's unemployment rate was 7.4 percent in August; the nation's was 4.6 percent.